They are NOT "illegals"

I'm just giving you the hard questions to pose to them. I don't understand them. On the legal end, I was literally one of them. I worked for John Tanton before most of these people knew who he was. But, I knew we had to have knowledgeable people to fight the fight. And so, I worked IN immigration law for six years. I wanted the FACTS. Consequently I worked for the prosecution side, defense side, expert witness, and consultant for attorneys that didn't want to read books in order to apply the law. So, we are arguing semantics and NOBODY agrees with them - as I proved, not even their own attorneys agree with their take on the law.

That is neither here or there. If people "don't belong here," then maybe those making that statement should hold themselves accountable and answer some basic questions. I have some:

1) Do those people believe that you must be a citizen in order to qualify for unalienable Rights?
2) If so, do they realize that when Thomas Jefferson penned those words there was no such thing as a citizen of the United States and wouldn't be until more than a decade and a war later?
3) If the so - called "illegals" don't belong here (sic), then how do the blacks belong here? Blacks only have citizenship due to an illegally ratified amendment to the Constitution.
4) If the government is in the Rights granting business, can they not revoke the Right to keep and bear Arms?
5) Are the critics spewing that nonsense aware that the objective of the current immigration laws (the ones they are adamant about defending) were passed to dilute the white vote in America?
6) If, as they claim, this is just about people committing a federal civil misdemeanor, what objections do they have if we create a guest worker status and repeal the quota system?
7) If we expect people to become citizens just to work in the United States, what is the real reason they have their boxers in a bunch knowing that white people are less than a decade from being the minority?
8) If the foreigners are "stealing" our jobs, then the jobs belong to the government, not the person that created the job. Isn't that the definition of socialism?

Another:

"Here's a few links to articles at the top of Google when I searched "prosecutions for unlawful entry"

"American Immigration Council" notices that "8 U.S.C. § 1325 makes it a crime to unlawfully enter the United States."

www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/research/immigration-prosecutions

Syracuse University is apparently keeping track of prosecutions for illegal entry. Regarding these prosecutions, they say this:

"In September 2021, just 24 individuals were prosecuted in federal court for unlawful entry (8 USC 1325) as the lead charge. Since June 2020, the number of unlawful entry prosecutions each month has never been higher than 35, making last month consistent with more than a year of data. However, this is remarkably low compared to the 12 months prior to the start of the pandemic. In March 2020 the average number of these prosecutions per month exceeded 4000. Just three years ago, in September 2018, the number of unlawful entry prosecutions in a single month was about 8000."

trac.syr.edu/tracreports/crim/665/#:~:text=Unlawful%20Entry%20Prosecutions,than%20a%20year%20of%20data

Improper entry is not a crime. It is a civil violation of a civil statute. The statute itself refers all criminal violations to be tried in a criminal court as per Title 18 of the United States Criminal Code. EVERY CRIMINAL violation mentioned in Title 8 USC 1325 has a correlative statute in Title 18 of the United States Code. The offense NOT in Title 18 is improper entry. It is not a crime - "NOR SHOULD IT BE" according to Rudy Giuliani, who served as ... WHOSE attorney? Keep quoting the non-profits from both sides. The liberals are just as bad as the former "conservatives" as the objective of the left is not to be understood by those too lazy to think. They are proving that what I'm saying is accurate and true.

When the right bought into this B.S. that Liberty can be criminalized, it set the wheels in motion for the right to make an ass of themselves. They started out with the so - called "Patriot Act" and followed that up with the National ID / REAL ID Act - E Verify, both of which were introduced into Congress by Tea Party Republican U.S. Rep. James Sensenbrenner. The so - called "Patriot Act" was passed just after 9 - 11 under the pretext of keeping us safe from foreign terrorists. It essentially gutted the Fourth Amendment. Now, all the LEOs have to do is claim that you have something to do with "terrorism" and your Rights are conveniently ignored. Who is getting prosecuted? It is mostly white males that are victims of the so - called "Patriot Act." BEFORE 9 - 11 over 80 percent of the American people were against National ID. They were especially against National ID predicated on a person's Socialist Surveillance Number ... ooops "Social Security Number" and now the numbers have flipped in the exact opposite direction. The Republicans, especially the Tea Party types are the most vocal advocates of a Surveillance Society / POLICE STATE that is Orwellian at the very least. And they advocate left wing SOCIALIST solutions to immigration woes.

The nutty wall idea includes the pretext of "needing" the Constitution Free Zone. The Constitution Free Zone is any area within 100 miles of the border where the Dept. of Homeland (IN) Security will exercise long-standing constitutional and statutory authority permitting suspicionless and warrantless searches at the border and its functional equivalent. Over two thirds of the American people live within the Constitution Free Zone where constitutional guarantees can (and have been) suspended. In the future, the law can be expanded through that precedent. How? If the police can violate your Rights within 100 miles of the border to pursue so - called "illegal aliens" then NOTHING could stop them for searching your property at 2 am on the pretext of pursuing a fleeing suspect.

This entire human registration agenda is so pathetic, the average fifth grader would understand my objections to it. Once we are all "documented" and have no constitutional protections, there can NEVER be a successful resistance to tyranny and oppression. The left loves it. And don't let them fool you. Without that human registration, their background check lobbying wouldn't be worth a fart in wild whirlwind. Despite what the dumb asses who bought into the Clinton agenda are saying, the 14th Amendment (and bear in mind I believe that to be an illegally ratified amendment) protects the undocumented just as it protects you and I:

www.thoughtco.com/undocumented-immigrants-and-constitutional-rights-3321849

The people who push for a POLICE STATE as a solution to immigration woes have never had their door kicked down at 2 am, beaten, tortured, jailed, held incommunicado, been arrested without a warrant and without the probable cause it takes to get a warrant. They don't know what it's like to be held incommunicado and never go before a judge to get bail. They cannot fathom what it's like to be taken out of society without due process because some jackass unilaterally decides that you're guilty. They don't know what it's like to presume that someone is guilty of a crime without the benefit of a presumption of innocence / innocent until proven guilty. And yet, knowing that the 14th Amendment requires the law to treat us the same as foreigners SUSPECTED of being here without papers, those idiots would shitcan the Constitution on the premise that "they don't belong here." If you think that the lobbying efforts of right and left wing zealots who are screwing the white people is authoritative, then obviously you didn't get much out of the rulings by the people administering the law. I've been where they haven't been, so I can respond to every link you can dredge up.

I want to say something here and hope that you will always remember to refer back to this thread:

I don't understand why those who chant the "illegal aliens" mantra cannot use critical thinking skills in order to address this. I get the WHY insofar as board owners censor the truth. They are not constitutionalists, but rather left wing disinformation agents taking advantage of rubes. That is obvious by bearing in mind that they find reading ten or twelve paragraphs to be intimidating and a daunting task. They have all day to argue and post B.S., but they don't have the five minutes it takes to read ten or twelve paragraphs. It takes more of their time to type up a post bitching about it than it does to give you an honest response.

So, here is where I get lost. You're a "Chinaman" despite the fact that you are, by citizenship, an American... that seems to be what I'm reading. As far as those guys are concerned the Hispanics "don't belong here." The easy out here is to dismiss this as being racist. HOWEVER, that wouldn't explain the fact that they endorse black political candidates. By endorsement from their standard bearer those same people will be voting for Stacey Abrams, a Democrat, for Governor of Georgia over conservative Republican Brian Kemp. By endorsement they will be voting for another black guy, Herschel Walker, who is proving to be a major embarrassment for the Republican Party. How do these unqualified hacks merit consideration if you are just a "Chinaman?" If they wanted to be racist about it, they could admit that the 14th Amendment was illegally ratified, which would call into question the notion of having black people running for public office. Add to that those same people want to enforce immigration laws that were designed to subtly wage of war of genocide against the white race. How convoluted can it get!

The sad reality is that if a person can be labeled an "illegal" anything absent due process, that principle can and IS used against other segments of society. I know it can be because I've been pursued under that same legal logic by the feds. Having earned my Right to disagree with them by putting my life on the line for the cause, I'm due an honest reply from those non-thinking dolts. The right wing has been conned by the left and they have to double down now to save face. This should be about much more than their egos. Their easy out is to accuse me of trolling them. This issue damn near cost me my life. There is no way I can sit on my ass and let these incompetent, non-thinking hacks send other innocent people to face what I did. Most people are not as well versed in the law as I am. Virtually all of the former patriots that got stuck in a similar circumstance went to jail, prison, were flipped and work as Confidential Informants or Disinformation Agents or they were killed. If you were to go out and try to find actual leaders of the "movement" (for lack of a more descriptive adjective) that were around in the mid 1980s to mid 1990s and still active and / or willing to share their expertise for activists you'd be hard pressed to find half a dozen. Compare that with the scores of civil rights activists that are 60, 70, 80, and beyond still dispensing their advice and wisdom to the next generations.

Right now the only people left from the good old days are guys like Alex Jones. Jones was flipped years ago because his fan base consisted of whites opposed to the capitulation of America to Jews. Jones married a Jewish woman. He cannot be objective with that audience. He is a Disinformation Agent. You might find a few guys that worked for Fox News (like Glenn Beck) which was owned (primarily) by a member of the Council on Foreign Relations - the conservatives arch nemesis during my lifetime... until this immigration issue came along. My reality is that we had this immigration issue won in the 1990s. The right got conned and now they are doing more to dismantle the Constitution through stupidity than the left is able to do by putting billions of dollars and thousands of activists on the streets. The right does more to destroy America via stupidity than the left does on purpose. Having nearly lost my very life over this issue, there's not a snowball's chance in Hell that they can silence me unless they intend on killing me.

The door is open for Trump supporters and the far left alike to check in and tell us where they think we got this wrong. When I used to work in immigration law, I'd challenge my critics to spend a few weeks with me. If, after a few weeks they could sell an immigration judge on their interpretation of the law, I would give them FIVE times their salary per time spent. If they worked 40 hours on a job for X number of hours and their employer paid them Y number of dollars than I would pay FIVE times that amount for 40 hours of their time spent convincing an immigration judge that improper entry were a crime or that prosecuting all those cases was remotely viable. After many years of offering that deal NO TAKERS.

I'm almost envious of the left for flipping the right so easily. I despise the left because an Orwellian society is a nightmare, not something the people should be looking forward to. Any form of equality that must be enforced at the barrel of a gun is wrong and by using force to encourage compliance is unjustifiable tyranny. For the right to continue to be confused about Liberty, you really need to be IN this discussion.

In my mind the point to be made here is that people are not illegal by virtue of just coming into the U.S. MAGA can double down on their ignorance but in the real world those in the legal field argue over what is a civil infraction compared to what is a crime. One time on a cop board  two of them argued with another cop regarding improper actions like lane changes. Was it civil or criminal? They could not agree and yet two had law degrees. Improper entry is not a crime as it does not merit a prison stint for the first offense. Neither does a single deportation hearing keep one from becoming a citizen later on. Repeated infractions of the law in virtually any offense become a felony issue. DUI is a misdemeanor. Do it repeatedly and it becomes a felony. Entering the United States in and of itself is a civil infraction according to the authorities that enforce immigration law. That is beyond debate regardless of what social commentators and lawyers that do not practice immigration law say.

The big issue in the minds of the MAGA community is whether or not it should be a crime. Their own lawyer answered that. There is a link in a previous post as to what MAGA lawyer Rudy Giuliani said. It is not a crime nor should it be. Immigration deals with permanent residence. That is not why most of the people from south of the border come here. They come to do business. If they do not have unalienable rights as is preached on this board then nobody has unalienable rights. If we do not have unalienable rights then all that political maneuvering by the right to throw out bad laws is all for nothing. Either we have rights or we do not.

The MAGA people are naïve. They were against sanctuary cities for foreigners while the gun lobby was building Second amendment sanctuary cities. What worked for them could work for the right. The courts have now said that Second amendment sanctuary cities are illegal. That being the case someone can bring suit against sanctuary cities for foreigners. It is the same principle. The right accidentally created a win on the immigration issue and they cannot follow through because they are too consumed by the argument over enforcing questionable immigration laws as crimes. They are wasting opportunities and giving the left more and more victories.

So, I'd like to wrap this up for detractors and everyone else. Coming into the United States is a civil infraction of the law. However, even the experts argue over semantics. I have no real dog in the fight EXCEPT my own Liberty. IF we take up the presupposition that every violation of the law is a crime and there is no such thing as a civil infraction, at some point the law is used against you and I. You wake up one morning to find that you can't get insurance on your car because improper U Turns are now a criminal offense and you have an improper U Turn on your record. Rudy Giuliani, Trump's own attorney, stated that "it is NOT A CRIME NOR SHOULD IT BE." He cited the impossibility of prosecuting improper entry as a criminal offense, but he didn't go into the long term ramifications. I am doing that.

Under the illegally ratified Fourteenth Amendment, if improper entry infractions are a crime, then so to are traffic violations and every other kind of violation of the law. That's the bottom line.

When people say that laws like Title 8 USC 1325 exist for a reason, they're right. But, for what reason? Title 8 USC 1325 was introduced into Congress by Senator Coleman Livingston Blease in 1929. According to Wikipedia:

"As U.S. senator, he advocated penalties for interracial couples attempting to get married, criticized US First Lady Lou Hoover for inviting a black guest to tea at the White House, and was the architect of Section 1325.

...The movement Blease led was largely characterized by white supremacy and not social policy. Segregation was also encouraged under Blease. A proposal put forward by Blease (and passed into law) segregated the black and white convicts of county chain gangs ..he told a Charlotte, North Carolina newspaper: "I think the greatest mistake a white man ever made was to put his hand in his pocket to educate a nigger. You can’t educate a horse or a mule or a cow, and you can't educate a nigger."

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cole_L._Blease

The law was passed by a man wanting to maintain "White Supremacy." For good or bad, that was the meaning behind the law. But, it should be noted that Title 8 USC 1325 was not prosecuted as a crime until at least 1965 when Congress decided to put numerical limits on immigration. Most people writing news stories on this topic along with the political propaganda prostitutes on either side don't know the difference between immigration and entering the United States as a guest. And such a distinction did not exist until 1965 - period. Neither side can change that fact. They cannot cite you a case prior to 1965 of Title 8 USC 1325 being enforced as a crime because it wasn't. Immigration implies path to citizenship. Personally, I'm opposed to wholesale citizenship. And there is where the topic becomes a whizzing contest, not a discussion.

But, we're grown adults so I'm not changing their mind; they aren't changing mine. At the end of the day the left hopes that you call it "illegal immigration" because that will allow the government to prosecute all infractions of the law as crimes. All I can say is that there are lot of idiots that have lost their Freedom and Liberty by pushing for every infraction of the law to be pursued as a crime. Neither position will solve the issue of foreigners coming here.

The time has come to confront WHY the law was put into place. The earlier generations believed in racial and cultural integrity. The law NEVER was about registering humans like cars or cattle. Those who obsess over the issue want a POLICE STATE. They keep asking questions they sure as HELL don't want the answer to. That's why we're bogged down in the ONE aspect of the issue. Okay, so if it isn't illegal to come here and the law was put into place to promote "White Supremacy," then how do you stop the flow without the ultimate POLICE STATE? If you ever find someone with the guts to want that discussion, we can do a thread and end the B.S. As it stands, the right has been duped into furthering aims of the left and they will predictably fail to solve their perceived problem. I've watched them fail for the last quarter of a century since this became a popular topic and a decade from now, there will be more non-Whites that don't want to be citizens here... UNLESS we have a real conversation and action to follow once they've been told the answers.